TV Show Discussion Thread

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BadTurtle
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Fri May 09, 2014 7:03 am

Eucrid wrote:Reality shite for compete dullards vs top notch genre fiction. Seem pretty far apart to me.
Top notch genre fiction? Hardly.

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Fred__Elliott
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Fri May 09, 2014 7:26 am

care to elaborate BadTurtle?

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BadTurtle
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Fri May 09, 2014 7:39 am

Fred__Elliott wrote:care to elaborate BadTurtle?
It's good at what it does (I'm talking about the TV show here, I imagine the books are better) very entertaining but hardly the highest quality. Plenty of wasted space in there and it's nothing ground breaking. For a fantasy show its impressive but top notch genre fiction it is not. You're not going to compare it to Hitchcock or Welles, or even The Sopranos.
I don't think the tv show would stand up to careful scrutiny at all.

ishouldcoco
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Fri May 09, 2014 8:00 am

He's right you know!

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never_green
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Fri May 09, 2014 9:41 am

sure why would you be comparing GOT to a hitchcok or welles movie? and then comparing it to what is perceived as the greatest tv show ever is a bit harsh too

while maybe not traditionally ground breaking, i do think it's unlike anything we've seen before

genre tv has never been done on this scale and i think that's a big reason behind its popularity

add in the fact that something so costly doesn't pander to the masses by talking down to its viewers makes it something truly unique

ishouldcoco
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Fri May 09, 2014 10:12 am

there's a difference between being smart and respecting your viewers compared to being a fucking mess of epic proportions.

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Eucrid
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Fri May 09, 2014 10:14 am

Its not a mess though. Its just big. There is a difference.

ishouldcoco
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Fri May 09, 2014 10:16 am

It's badly put together. Most people haven't a clue who various characters are, let alone key storyline strands.

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never_green
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Fri May 09, 2014 10:22 am

it's a complex world and i am glad that they're not going out of their way to hold the viewers hand the whole way through

to constantly remind viewers who each character is and what they've done would lead to a mess of a tv show

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BadTurtle
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Fri May 09, 2014 10:23 am

never_green wrote:sure why would you be comparing GOT to a hitchcok or welles movie? and then comparing it to what is perceived as the greatest tv show ever is a bit harsh too

while maybe not traditionally ground breaking, i do think it's unlike anything we've seen before

genre tv has never been done on this scale and i think that's a big reason behind its popularity

add in the fact that something so costly doesn't pander to the masses by talking down to its viewers makes it something truly unique
Because Eucrid called it top-notch genre fiction, and those would be some others in the category if that's where you're putting it. It's not though. For fantasy fiction, it's very good, but that's because fantasy is a poor genre in general when you consider it alongside crime, sci-fi or horrors very best, it doesn't hold up as well.

ishouldcoco
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Fri May 09, 2014 10:26 am

never_green wrote:it's a complex world and i am glad that they're not going out of their way to hold the viewers hand the whole way through

to constantly remind viewers who each character is and what they've done would lead to a mess of a tv show
If it was directed better there wouldn't be a need to remind them. Sure it is complex, too complex. There is a case of biting off more than you can chew. I think GOT is the perfect example. All over the shop so it is.

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never_green
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Fri May 09, 2014 10:27 am

i assumed he meant within the world of tv as he was comparing two shows at the time

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mooch
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Fri May 09, 2014 10:47 am

ah coco, GOT isn't that hard to follow
I'd be really pissed off if they simplified it or dumbed it down.
hate when shows do that

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Dick Jones
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Fri May 09, 2014 10:51 am

ishouldcoco wrote:
never_green wrote:it's a complex world and i am glad that they're not going out of their way to hold the viewers hand the whole way through

to constantly remind viewers who each character is and what they've done would lead to a mess of a tv show
If it was directed better there wouldn't be a need to remind them. Sure it is complex, too complex. There is a case of biting off more than you can chew. I think GOT is the perfect example. All over the shop so it is.
You're talking out of your arse now.

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BadTurtle
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Fri May 09, 2014 10:53 am

What I didn't like about DJs comment is that he seemed to be comparing them as though GOT was the polar opposite to those shows. Plenty of cheap thrills in GOT too, and not much in the way of genuine depth. It's a well made and well written bit of fantasy but it's very disposable all the same.

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Dick Jones
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Fri May 09, 2014 11:03 am

It was a throwaway comment.

I used made in chelsea as an example as it's a show made by cunts about cunts for cunts.

Plus, the viewership is assumed to be so dumb that at the beginning of each scene, the names of those present comes up on screen doesn't it? Now that's spoonfeeding.

ishouldcoco
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Fri May 09, 2014 11:07 am

How is that talking out my arse Dick Jones? Is the direction in GOT perfection? Can it not be criticized? I have said it a zillion times so it is getting old, but it's badly put together. So I would guess that whoever directs it all is to blame.

Mooch I'm not asking for it to be dumbed down. I just think it's a mess. And any discussion I ever hear in person or read on the internet usually contains a large amount of "who is he again? Why did they do that? What happened before?" It's a mess. A big, shiny, epic, often entertaining, sexy, mess.

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Eucrid
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Fri May 09, 2014 11:13 am

Dick Jones wrote:
ishouldcoco wrote:
never_green wrote:it's a complex world and i am glad that they're not going out of their way to hold the viewers hand the whole way through

to constantly remind viewers who each character is and what they've done would lead to a mess of a tv show
If it was directed better there wouldn't be a need to remind them. Sure it is complex, too complex. There is a case of biting off more than you can chew. I think GOT is the perfect example. All over the shop so it is.
You're talking out of your arse now.
Yep. Michelle McLaren is directing a lot of the episodes at the moment I think and she's a brilliant director. Did loads of great Breaking Bad episodes.

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Fred__Elliott
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Fri May 09, 2014 11:14 am

It sticks to the structure of the books by and large Coco, which is where 90% of the problems you have it with stem from. The amount of dialogue left out is unbelievable. What might be a 2 minute segment on the show could be a whole chapter in the books. Also, the structure of the story in the books, is that each chapter is told from a POV. So it could be Cersei in Kings landing once, and then Jon Snow at the wall next. So that adds to the disjointed nature because they are following it in the show. On top of that, there are so many side characters who are left out, or 3 characters are merged into one for the sake of the story etc - I can see where you're coming from.

And I was staying out of this argument because I know you are just referring to the tv show specifically, but I just wanted to put some context on why it is like that. It's an adaptation of a story, and obviously the writer of the story wanted it told in much the same way as he wrote it

ishouldcoco
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Fri May 09, 2014 11:26 am

exactly jake. I haven't even read the books but it is clear that it is a messy transition.

Eucrid, just because she might have done a good job with BB doesn't give her a pass here. But it's been a mess since the first series. The whole concept was just executed badly. It could have been amazing. As it is it's got shitloads of faults.

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